Illegal Detention & Mounted Police Charge on Student Demo – Welcome To The ‘Free World’!

November 26, 2010

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6 Responses to “Illegal Detention & Mounted Police Charge on Student Demo – Welcome To The ‘Free World’!”

  1. […] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Dave Edwards, Dave Edwards and StarSparkle, Mat M. Mat M said: RT @snookcocker: Illegal Detention & Mounted Police Charge on Student Demo – Welcome To The ‘Free World’! « My Arse http://bit.ly/hRUd5X […]

  2. Michael said

    No water cannon, no CS spray, no rubber bullets. No detention and torture, no being sent to prison and being left to die there. No political prisoners.

    Even in other democratic, 1st world, free countries (just 15% of the world) you get at least one of the above.

    A police force that is willing to take the hits to protect innocent small business owners from having their livelihoods destroyed. Police that don’t want cars, bought and paid for by innocent taxpayers, smashed and burnt out.

    A country where you can protest, make your point, and not have your stuff f***ed in the process.

    Indeed, welcome to the free world!

    • “water cannon” – “CS spray” – “rubber bullets” = all of which have been used by the British state on occasion, the latter with deadly force in Northern Ireland. Living in a former mining community we know only too well how willingly the state will use any form of violence it feels it can get away with. That they are not more commonly used is thanks to a long history of people taking a stand, rather than the actions of a benevolent government (an oxymoron if ever there was one). Which is why we must take a stand against kettling and a non-accountable police force.

      “No detention” – apart from the aforementioned arbitary detention known as ‘kettling’ of course – something which has been frowned upon in England ever since Magna carta 😉

      “torture” – “being sent to prison and being left to die there” – “political prisoners” = again the British state has regularly been shown to be complicit in all of these forms of abuse despite it’s supposedly ‘humanitarian’ foreign policy.

      “A police force that is willing to take the hits to protect innocent small business owners from having their livelihoods destroyed” – innocent small business in Whitehall?

      “Even in other democratic, 1st world, free countries (just 15% of the world) you get at least one of the above.” – are you really trying to suggest that we live in the freest of all the ‘free’ countries. What utter rubbish. We live in the third most heavily surveillanced state on the planet. And all of your beloved ‘democratic’, 1st world, countries have seen a massive and ongoing decline in civil liberties. Check out John Kampfner’s ‘Freedom For sale’ for a good overview of the problem. It’s just a shame that it’s only kids and young adults who have the strength of mind to make a stand against our blatantly undemocratic political system.

      The greatest obstacle to freedom is the belief that you already have it!

  3. Michael said

    The ‘containment’ tactic (the Police have never used the word Kettling, even internally) has been used many times elsewhere at other locations and indeed, protected the innocent and their property from getting trashed.

    I never said we were the freest, maybe you can say were I said that? I clearly spoke of our Met Police and how they respond to violent disorder in this country, compared to other Police in like countries. The low countries use water cannon, but as u point out, they perhaps have less CCTV – it will often be mixed in terms of freedom, but again we are talking about the Police.

    Perhaps u can tell me who in England is a political prisoner since u disagree with me on that too? Have u travelled around Russia? China? Khazakstan? Maybe Africa? Some of us have travelled, lived and worked in these parts and have real insight. There are still some people in the UK that have never left their own county, yet talk with great authority on how crap England is (Police) but have no frame of reference to gage that.

    I guess I find it funny that a bunch of students (I was one a decade ago) think it’s so out of order that they should pay their way. They only pay it back after reaching a certain level of salary (could take 10 yrs) and after 30 yrs anything outstanding gets written-off.

    These are 16-19 yr olds, who dont know anything about the real world cos they’re not there yet – hence the naive idealism.

    They talked of ‘oppression’ and ‘abuse of their rites
    ‘, like I implied earlier, when u get out into the real world and personally experience how things really are, u have an informed frame of reference to better gage your own life and country.

    All these armchair critics of ‘everything that’s shit about Britain’ define themselves more by their opinions than the thing they bitch about.

    • The ‘containment’ tactic – or whatever anyone chooses to call it – is still arbitrary detention and goes against the due process of law established in this country 800 years ago. As Benjamin Franklin (America’s founding fathers were also inspired by Magna carta) famously said “They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.” Should we protect objects at the risk of abusing liberties? So you see we are not talking about what’s ‘shit about Britain’ we are trying to defend what’s good about it before it is lost forever (and make no mistake, our liberties are being whittled away at an alarming rate).

      And contrary to your suggestion that we are armchair critics we have been on many, many demonstrations and have yet to see open attacks on innocent people (apart from those instigated by the police of course 😉 ). On Tuesday the students in Sheffield we cheered and applauded by the people they passed – hardly the actions of threatened innocents. It’s also worth bearing in mind that the only person killed at a British demonstration this year was a newspaper vendor (an innocent bystander and employee of a private business) who was murdered (technically manslaughter) by a member of the metropolitan police ON CAMERA!

      “These are 16-19 yr olds, who dont know anything about the real world cos they’re not there yet – hence the naive idealism.” – how very patronising, especially from somebody who is willing to be spoon-fed news and opinions without question. The myth of ‘good police vs violent mobs’ is used time and time again. A decade later, when the media know it’s safe to hint at the truth we suddenly find that the police played an active an antagonistic role in the dispute. At the time of the miner’s strike the official media line was that the police were protecting themselves from violent miners. In truth the police instigated the violence with mounted charges and the miners responded in kind. It doesn’t matter how widely traveled you are, Micheal, if you are prepared to walk around with your eyes closed. Which brings us to…

      “Perhaps u can tell me who in England is a political prisoner since u disagree with me on that too?” – What we said was the British state has a long and well documented involvement with states that DO lock up prisoners without trial, etc.; from the SAS training of the Khmer Rouge to complicity with Guantanamo. In truth nation states are slaves to neoliberalism, which is why it no longer matters who you vote for; the same policies are implemented regardless. Britain has a special role in Empire, and it is a role that is beyond the control of the British people as long as they sit back and allow it to happen. Thank god for the naive students we say 😉

      Finally – “I never said we were the freest, maybe you can say were I said that?” We were responding to the statement “Even in other democratic, 1st world, free countries (just 15% of the world) you get at least one of the above.” Which implies that we are among the freest (admittedly not necessarily THE freest) of the 15% of democratic 1st world countries. The unquestionable fact remains that this top 15% exercises a relative – but still limited – freedom among it’s own people at the expense of the vast majority of the human population. It is no coincidence that the world’s poorest countries were those decimated by the savage land-piracy committed against them by the imperial expansion of western nations. Unless, of course, you’re going to tell us that in your ‘real world’ the last 500 years of history never happened?

      It may be naive, but we believe in liberties and commons for all, anything less is indeed ‘oppression’. This is not simple ‘bitching’, it is a commitment to the ongoing fight against abuses of privilege and power.

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